EMP way too OP - EMP needs a nerf


#269

You’re too funny!

20 funnies

Spot on with your counter argument though. Exactly what I was thinking. Someone has lost common sense as well as credibility.


#270

I would upload the replays so people can analyse them if it wasnt for this damn 1v1 glitch.

atfirst I lost when he had 5 engines, then I switched one of my engines for a plat plate to simulate a clawed energy mech. he lost then, and only won after he attatched 7 modules (6 engines, 1 booster) and also won with 7 engines I think.

should be noted that both times I was able to get double valient combos. with higher regen and more obstruction of my combos he might have won with less. he also didnt take advantage of my blind spot at range 3 after my bunker and EMP had been fired which a more mobile mech might have.

we’ll do some more testing at a later point anyway, but for now I have procrastinated from my revision too long already. I have an exam in like 30 hours.

e e k.


#271

Do what they did for G.O.A.T. Fight in 2v2 style, but only use the tester mechs.


#272

For real balance and fairness we need to revive heat…


#273

At first it was six engines. You lost to Mercy on the 4th turn.

Then I lost with 5 engines, and then won with 5 engines and a booster.

Then you added the plate and I won with 6 engines and a booster.

The idea was to see at what point regen can’t recover, and at what point drain occurs.

However, we used the most extreme circumstances. With me not missing an action point at all.

Adding mobility will just result in lost weapon release, and this could be followed by counter mobility. I think pointless to add mobility.

This would be both versions of the mech. The one with legs has no TP. Which do you think would stand the best chance of winning from any starting range?


#274
  1. I’ve read many times on the forum that 500 Energy / 300 Regen was the standard. But maybe you are the one who definite standard?
  2. I have calculated it: if you have 500/300, you take ~2500 dmg against the build “1 EMP + dual VS + dual Ash + FS” in 7 rounds (I took max dmg for every shot, with drain dmg, with drone from round 1). We are far from your 2k HP loss in 3 rounds…
  3. Telling me “stop talking” is the worst thing to say if you actually want me to shut up, lol.
    Everyone is crying about the buff that the arena skill gives to energy dmg for EMP (up to 472) but the buff of energy cap/regen makes no difference, really? (for me, energy cap from 700 to 840 is a big difference if you wanna use dual EMP + FS in one round)

Feel free to teach me if I get it wrong.
I’ve started this game 2 months ago (and I note that you did not welcome me). I’m rank 10 atm without using any skill from Arena Shop yet. My main mech is a mass Heater and second is a Pys one. The only premium item I use is Flaming Scope because its really fun (even if it doesn’t match well with my mass heater). You know everything about me as a player now.

Until now, no one proved I said something stupid. And If someone proves it, that will not make me stupid anymore so…

@bestplayerintheworld If you go out of range of the enemy weapon, he needs to lose an action to move or use TP/Charge/Hook and you aren’t drained as much. Regenerated energy helps you staying alive enough rounds to turn the enemy’s uses into a loss. If you are smart enough, enemy can’t shoot you twice a round every round. Thus, your calculation is wrong (or you fight against bots only).
VS has 2 uses only. Bunker and EMP have 1 use. Ash has 3 uses and produces heat. FS needs to be reloaded after 3 shots… Enemy can’t shot at you indefinitely, there is always a break that you can exploit.
And if EMP can be countered “easily”, it can’t be considered as OP.
The key is to force enemy to use his close range weapons (Bunker and EMP mostly. I admit Ash Creator is a big problem with 3 uses). Once he used his close range weapons, don’t be silly by going into VS range, just stay at range 1-2 to regen energy and use your weapons. Swords are good to get you closer to enemy after a push.

As @El_Metre said, regen is way more important than a big energy cap to survive against drainers. A big capacity allows you to keep energy during first rounds but regeneration is more useful in the middle/end of the battle.


#275

You hold on your theorie like …

Range 11 :question:

Did you realize that most of the battles (1v1 in a 2v2) last only about 6 - 8 shots / hits, because of the high damages :question:

Whats your ingame name :question:

And you also still missed the main point of this thread …

I will repeat it until you get it …

You missunderstand a main thing here in this thread - it is NOT about couter building - every build can be countered :exclamation:
And it is NOT about if I can win against EMP users or not :exclamation:

This thread is about …

EMP way to OP - EMP needs a nerf :exclamation:

A single OP item :exclamation:

Energy build first turn (2 moves) if not started …

-393 Energy damage EMP -123 Energy damage BunkerShell

  • -619 Energy damage 1st Turn … (the 20% from Arena Shop added)
    Same example using the Drone above :exclamation:

Numbers don’t lie :exclamation:

EMP way to OP - EMP needs a nerf :exclamation:

:white_check_mark:


#276

Welcome to the forums. Forgive me if I don’t read all the Introduce Yourself threads.

Now, just to make this clear, things are way different in R10 than they are in top 20. What works for you back there, does not necessarily work at the top, most likely not at all.

Trying to school advanced R1 players with way more experience and knowledge of the game is quite naive.

No offense mate, sorry if I come across as rude, but you’d be better off trying to understand the challenges in top ranks instead of trying to defend your moot arguments.

Again, the EMP is way too OP, and yes it can easily be countered, but at the cost of mech balance. My anti-energy can take on 1 1/2 2 EMP/VS builds quite easily. Members here will affirm. However, again, this thread is NOT about counter-building, but about restoring balance by nerfing EMP. Please understand that once and for all.

Thank you sir.


#277

I agree with E here. Sure, you can build a mech that counters emp builds.
And then you can get crushed by all mechs who don’t use emp lol


#278

My observations: EMP is OP if you insist on using 2-3 of the same mech type, none of them energy and/or none of them energy free builds. Further, if you’ve been used to being OP yourself and the EMP has forced you to alter your sacred build, making your mech susceptible to other dangers, EMP seems OP. Further still, if it isn’t a valuable weapon for your build and play style, EMP seems OP.

In this moment, top 10 players are:

  • 3 heaters
  • heat, energy, heat (with no EMP)
  • phys, phys, energy (with no EMP)
  • heat, heat, heat
  • 3 energy (2 EMP)
  • heat, energy, energy (1 EMP)
  • energy, heat, energy (1 EMP)
  • 3 phys
  • phys, phys, energy (no EMP)
  • energy, energy, heat (no EMP)

Of the 12 energy mechs out of the top 10’s 30 mechs, 4 EMPs. EMP is not the problem.


#279

Ok, you are the EMP user, your build is = dual EMP + dual Bunker + dual VS + WF
I use for exemple my Pys Build you’ve seen before.
1st round: You drain my ~500 energy. You did ~500 dmg too (EMP+Bunker).
2nd round: Same with +200 more dmg cause I only have 300 regen. I have ~1100/2300 HP left.
3rd round: My ~300 regen is bigger than your drain dmg. You can only stomp me at close range and your drain dmg don’t hurt me anymore.
4rd round: If you teleport to use VS, you can shot once and I come back at close range (TP/Charge/Hook).
5rd round: If you are vicious enough to use legacy TP, not fair but ok, I still have ~600 HP left.
You need at least 4 more rounds to kill me (stomp+drone) but Betsy is the first to meet the angels (you lack of plating cause you need many energy engines to use EMP. I bury you with honors and fight with the next).

You can see that 600 energy drain dmg in first round is not fatal. So what is OP here?
And this Pys mech can be used against Pys mechs too (not the best but dual Anni work well to reduce enemy HP).

@Mr.E I regularly watch battles from top ranked players (I had the idea about dual Desolation, and I’ve seen it works well with @Wepwawet if I’m right).
You are in your right to believe EMP is an OP weapon, but I have the right to disagree, based on my analysis of it (and you have the right to think my analysis is wrong).
I even don’t use EMP myself and I think this item does more harm than good to energy mechs (because now everyone is carrying a lot of energy engines to counter them and it’s become harder for electricals without EMP to drain enemy).

But if you want to nerf EMP, you need to nerf VS and Ash first because they are more OP with their multi-uses and the additional effects (cap/regen dmg) than EMP (the difference is VS and Ash are premium items, so you meet them less often than epics EMP).


#280

NERF that EMP…


#281

Hey T-850.
Now, I know you are making very good observations and conclusions based off what you know.
Also, you are relatively new, but this is not an insult. We have all been there. I used to argue with the top players, saying that they were wrong, and that I knew what I was talking about.

However, based off what I can see, they are correct in this case. I think you also under-estimate what an energy mech in the top ranks can do in first turn. Especially with an EMP.

Despite this, you did put up a good argument, which I’m glad of. The forums are about discussion, and debates make it what it should be.


#282

a lot of the energy mechs i face at ranks 2 thru 4 have at least 1 emp build and then either switch over to the mech with at least a valiant sniper and/or ash creator on it. a very effective tactic i must say.

600+ energy on a phys to counter one weapon, and i have to pray that i dont start second on many occasions

and the same could be said about heat bombs, except i can actually control my fate there. there really aren’t op weapons that deal insane heat dmg beyond 4 range


Range and Weight Strategy
Range and Weight Strategy
EMP is too OP - EMP needs to be nerfed
May be the best way to nerf EMP
#283

I think EMP is good it is fair enough because when you transformed it into mythical you’ll get 300 energy damage and it has 300 energy cost so it is really fair. you only need to build a hybrid mech.


#284

The EMP is not for hybrid mechs

Hybrids simply do not have the energy capacity to counter or use this thing

In order to use it, you need a great amount of energy and regeneration

Same for countering it, however many physical torsos and heat torsos are unable to get to the energy levels of energy mechs, which is why it may be unfair


#285

The only way to counter EMP is to build an hybrid mech that’s what i mean, hot flash + flaminator and a hammer.


#286

Stop while you’re ahead. Because this very argument will put you on the “those who don’t know what the hell they’re talking about” list.


#287

@Transcendant@T-850 is pretty ignorant, he repeated his “story” how to build a counter now around 3 times, and he will not accept, that …

he missunderstand a main thing here in this thread - it is NOT about couter building - every build can be countered :exclamation:
And it is NOT about if I can win against EMP users or not :exclamation:

This thread is about …

EMP way to OP - EMP needs a nerf :exclamation:

A single OP item :exclamation:

:wink:

P.S.: I will now not answer him anymore, it’s sensless, discussing with such story repeaters, where the argument is wrong :exclamation:


#289

Me too, agree with you about this.